Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

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Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 28 Nov 2000, 20:17

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 

Hi,

I write these lines because I am very angry about Centura and I can not
understand this company politic. Maybe someone from Centura might say
some words to this. I am a software developer and I really(!) do
understand that we have to secury our software. I also do understand
that you like your customers to register your software products.
Everything of these points are ok and everyone will understand this, but
what I can not understand ist why it is necessary to combine this with
the hardware. It is indisputable!!!!!

What happened:

Because I have to register our Centura 2000 CTD, in fact of the time
limitation at the end of the month, I start the lmAdmin tool and try to
register the software ask it was described by a German Centura officer.
I do not want to meantion that there is no fax number or email address
where to send this register information. After I search the internet
site I do find an email address and a fax number. This is really not the
point. The point is that CTD2000 do not run anymore. THIS IS REALLY
UNBELEAVABLE:!!
I do not want to know why this happens. I only have to think about the
situation that we do have to deliver a new version next day. What should
I do in this case ..?! This time it was 17:30 and nobody at the office
of Centura Germany could help me. The time limit should finish at the
end of November and now I can not open Centura. What should I do if this
happen at a weekend ..?! I really can not tell any of our clients to
wait till someone at the Centura office can send me a licence code. In
the worst case this might take 1 or 2 days (answer from Centura
Germany).
I really do not want to think about this cenario any further. A
motherboard might crash and I do not have the chance to install Centura
again. If this might happen one day and we do have to fix a bug or to
deliver a new version we are at the end. This is our business. Sorry,
but if Centura do not change this politic very soon, we do have to look
something different.

If I see this evening I can not work for four hours right know and I do
not know what will happen tomorrow. I think I use the time to evaluate
some different tools L

MfG

Oliver Otto

P.S. Beside this everyone knows that this politic is against German law
and some other american companies do not practise this anymore. Is there
really nobody at Centura who is looking at there clients.

wilhelm
Germany
Posts: 295
Joined: 22 Mar 2017, 08:49
Location: Cologne

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by wilhelm » 29 Nov 2000, 09:52

 Posted by:  Wilhelm Speck 

My point exactly.
I was very angry about this policy too, when CTD2.0 was released.
For this reason our development is stuck with CTD1.5. Due to OUR company
policy concerning dongled software, we cannot upgrade.

I sincerely hope Centura come to their senses very soon...

I am feeling with you

Wilhelm

Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 29 Nov 2000, 12:25

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 

Hallo Wilhem,

yes I agree with you. But my basic point right now is that we still can not
work. Now we are at the second day and nobody can help us. I just talk to the
German chairman of Centura and we still can not use CTD2000. I really can not
use a system like this for our daily work :-(

The funny thing is that the temporary version should work. But it is not. I
can not understand that nobody is able to active the temporary version again.

So I can spend the time go on surfing today looking for some alternatives to
Centura :-)))

have a nice day,

Oliver Otto


--

P.S. Der Blick aus unserer Sicht:
http://www.genese.de/deutsch/Wir_uber_uns/Web-Kamera/web-kamera.htm

Radek Cerny

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Radek Cerny » 29 Nov 2000, 12:50

 Posted by:  Radek Cerny 

Hmmm as a long time Centura person all i can say is... its finally time to
let go and embrace the new world. The Microsoft .NET stuff is looking
pretty good. Kinda like 2nd generation Java and more. Even has a outline
option (collapse/expand) in the editor. A few days of pain for a lifetime
of gain. Do it.

Greg Moyer

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Greg Moyer » 29 Nov 2000, 15:01

 Posted by:  Greg Moyer 

I had thought that Centura dropped this key licencing scheme that they adopted
on Centura 2000? Just like most of us told them from the beginning, but they
didn't listen.

Hey Centura..... I told ya so!!!! :)

Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 29 Nov 2000, 16:05

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 


Hi,

no they did not and they seem not be able to send a key or anything else. No the
second day is over and we still can not work with CTD2000 :-(

Oliver Otto

--

P.S. Der Blick aus unserer Sicht:
http://www.genese.de/deutsch/Wir_uber_uns/Web-Kamera/web-kamera.htm

Scott
Australia
Posts: 451
Joined: 13 Mar 2017, 23:31
Location: Sydney, Australia

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Scott » 30 Nov 2000, 00:20

 Posted by:  Scott Booth 


You don't have to change hardware, just upgrading the OS is enough to lock
you out.

Patrick Bernard

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Patrick Bernard » 30 Nov 2000, 02:51

 Posted by:  Patrick Bernard 

Dear Oliver,

I am the (recently promoted) product manager for CTD and SQLBase, and I hope
I can shed some light on some of the issues you raised.

When the anti-piracy issue was reconsidered at centura, and solutions were
evaluated, it was found that few offered the degree of protection that was
sought. As there had been indications that in some Asian country the piracy
level for CTD was extremely high (CTD was rumored to be a leading
development tool, and we had only 1 company registered!!), it was decided to
try a protection system with a high degree of security.

With a simple license code, a copy can be purchased, then copied and
distributed along with the code. It was therefore decided to go with a
"node-lock" approach, forcing unique registration.

I will not deny that some issue probably were improperly assessed at that
time (I was not there then), but as a software developer you probably
realize we did it with customer benefit ultimately in mind (Should there be
less piracy and more sale, there are more revenues and we can enhance the
product more, hopefully making a profit on the way).

Since the system was implemented, it became apparent that a mistake had been
made. Some of it was preventable, while some of it was unforeseen.
Unfortunately, the unforeseen element were added to an already delicate
situation.

The software _is_ supposed to function until the 30th of November, and I
cannot tell from your message what may be wrong, but there seems to be
something falling in the "unforeseen" category.

The company we are contracting with for the security piece has had some
issues with delivery of the license code for some customers. Several were
resolved, but new ones seem to appear on a regular basis. This could not be
predicted as well, particularly considering their previous track record of
good service.

We were expecting a 24-48 hour turnover.

However, I do want to assure you that we have listened to, and heard, you,
the customer. We have taken steps to ease the installation of CTD.
Unfortunately, the security is already in place in CTD 2000 and it could
only be eased, but should you upgrade computers it should now be easier.

We are currently looking at a several different security solutions for the
upcoming HYDRA version, looking for some that would ask for registration,
but would not be linked to a machine (several web-base ones are looking
promising).

We probably will be asking for feedback on the issue in the near future.

This does not excuse the difficulty of CTD installation, but I hope it will
communicate our concern for the customer, and our desire to improve.

Sincerely,

Patrick Bernard

Ebusiness Director

Charity Silkebakken

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Charity Silkebakken » 30 Nov 2000, 03:11

 Posted by:  Charity Silkebakken 


Oliver and others,

Please see the updated information on http://www.centurasoft.com/license/.

I quote:

"Anyone who applies TODAY for a license key will get our new license
installer (which is an executable program that installs a new license) and
the right for a single user to install the software on up to three machines.
When customers install CTD 2000 on a new machine, they must run the license
installer on that machine in order to use the software. They do not have to
keep re-applying for new license keys. "

The new license installer should resolve the problems you have had with
getting the software to work. If you registered before we enacted the new
policy, you can re-send your registration form and get the new license
installer.

Also, if you had trouble registering the software (e.g. your emailed
registration bounced) or if you have been waiting more than 24 hours to
receive your license installer, please contact your Centura sales
representative IMMEDIATELY so that we can send it to you!

Charity Silkebakken

Centura Software Corp.

Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 30 Nov 2000, 10:03

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 


Please ..?!?! That is a joke isn't it ..? This is much more incredible as I
thought :-((

Oliver Otto

--

P.S. We still can not work. Now we are on the third day and no calls from
Centura :-(

Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 30 Nov 2000, 10:04

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 

Hallo Patrick,

I wrote before that I do understand that you have to protect your software but
it can not be that
this protection only produce cost on the clients site. Beside this our company
can not work with a
tool that stop working in fact of some "unforeseen" (<--your words) things. We
can not take this
risc. It is like bringing your car to the inspection and afterwards theowner of
the garage tells you:
We change the key system because it is more secret. The only problem is that the
key is not here.
But your car is ready. Just take the bus to go home we call you "one" day if the
key is here. You
agree with me that this scenario would follow up years of lawyers to solve the
question of costs. I
really do know what I say because our clients are lawyers.

I really do understand all your ideas installing a security system. We also do
something like this but
that try a dongle system or something like that. I do not know. Now I am at the
third (!!!) day and
I still can not work! Please, who pays for these days ..? Can you tell me ..?

If I read your last part that HYDRA will have a similar protection system, where
I have to order a
key than I can tell you that it is our end on the way with Centura. Our clients
are not so kind as I
and wait day after day to get a new version.

I think we will have a conference this afternoon. If we can still not work we
will have to find some
basic decisions for the future and this means: Alternatives.

Have a nice day.

Oliver Otto

--

P.S. We still can not work. Now we are on the third day and no calls from
Centura :-(


--

P.S. Der Blick aus unserer Sicht:
http://www.genese.de/deutsch/Wir_uber_uns/Web-Kamera/web-kamera.htm

Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 30 Nov 2000, 10:12

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 


Hallo Charity,

What happen here right now ..?!?! I really can not understand. Maybe Centura in
the US do act different. Over here you can phone Centura as often as you like
you will ever get the anser: This is because our mother company say this it is.
We can not do anything for you.

I am on the third day and I still do not be able to work. And I do not have any
useful hint from any Centura employee that really help. The only thing I hear is
you have to wait or just fill out the licence form. I did both but I will not
wait very long anymore.

Have a nice day.

Oliver Otto

--

P.S. On the third day not be able to work with CTD2000.

Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 30 Nov 2000, 10:14

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 


Hallo Charity,

What happen here right now ..?!?! I really can not understand. Maybe
Centura in
the US do act different. Over here you can phone Centura as often as you
like
you will ever get the anser: This is because our mother company say this
it is.
We can not do anything for you.

I am on the third day and I still do not be able to work. And I do not
have any
useful hint from any Centura employee that really help. The only thing I
hear is
you have to wait or just fill out the licence form. I did both but I
will not
wait very long anymore.

Have a nice day.

Oliver Otto

--

P.S. On the third day not be able to work with CTD2000.

wilhelm
Germany
Posts: 295
Joined: 22 Mar 2017, 08:49
Location: Cologne

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by wilhelm » 30 Nov 2000, 11:21

 Posted by:  Wilhelm Speck 

Hello Patrick,

I appreciate your statement. Unfortunately it does not help much.

Some thoughts come to mind:

1. It is the nature of any copy protection, that only the paying customer is
nagged by any difficulties that arrise from this. I anticipate you want more
paying customers. So why do you chase them away.
2. Very many existing customers are furious about this installation process
and do not upgrade. (I suppose you don´t have too many of them either)
3. Would you use a C-Compiler that stopped functioning if you updated or
repaired you OS-Installation, change your harddisk or any other
hardwarecomponents?
4. The customer support leaves much to be desired, but I thought it could
not get worse.
5. I know of no other software company where you have to pay or sign a
support contract to report bugs.
6. Let´s hope this is not the case but what if Centura goes out of business
or discontinues CTD. Then we would probably have complex programs developed
with CTD which we ourselves could not support or even compile any more.

Sorry if this sounds solely negative, I really think CTD is a great product.
But remember, only satisfied customers keep a great product alive...

Sincerly

Wilhelm Speck
Timescape Software

Oliver Otto

Warning: Do not develop with CTD2000

Post by Oliver Otto » 30 Nov 2000, 11:56

 Posted by:  Oliver Otto 


Heallo,

Yes this is really a funny thing. It has nothing to do with the licence problem
but is really crazy. I can top this point. We do have a RTC contract with a
service contract and we have to phone Centura to ask for every now version. I
can not understand why we do have to ask for new versions if we have a conbract.
Why is it not possible to send us each new version. No other computer company
did it this way. From Micrsoft and Novell I get much more CD's and new versions
as I want. From Centura I have to please about every new version which I pay a
long time before :-((

Oliver Otto

--

P.S. Der Blick aus unserer Sicht:
http://www.genese.de/deutsch/Wir_uber_uns/Web-Kamera/web-kamera.htm

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